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UrQuattro
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 2745
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 Posted: Mon Nov 07, 17:44 |
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I know that BWX is very good around setting up the wheel, as well as Tommy's videos of S1600 and such showed that there's a solution to my problem.
View this video: https://bhms.racesimcentral.net/movie/535
What is the throttle response like that? you see on a separate gauge that the pedal input and engine response is not proportional, and worse, is lagging in fall off. The filters in game are set on instant fall off/rise.
That's the main problem for me in RBR, without it Im sure I can be 10s quicker in any track. very difficult to be smooth with such situation. If you guys or anyone can help, please. I would appriciate it.
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Last edited by UrQuattro on Mon Nov 07, 18:32; edited 1 time in total |
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Jim B
Joined: 08 May 2005
Posts: 255
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 18:06 |
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The pedal movement and in game throttle % are realistic if you ask me. This is because there is no transmission resistance in neutral, so the car will keep revving up. The same would happen if you were sat in a real car and gave about 1/4 throttle, the car would slowly rev right up as there is no resistance from the transmission.
If the car was in gear, then the pedal movement would be more proportional to the in game engine revs.
The problem I have in RBR is if I press the brakes about 1/4 or less, the wheels lock up, meaning the brakes must be at 100 %?  Anybody got an ideas about this? |
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UrQuattro
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 2745
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 18:37 |
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Watch Tommy's S1600 video and you'll see what I mean. the current situation is NOT ok. Yes there is a response lag in throttle in real life, but this is rediculous the way it is now.
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Jim B
Joined: 08 May 2005
Posts: 255
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 18:40 |
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I get the same response and delays as you UrQuattro.
What I said about pedal movement and throttle % in game when the car is in neutral is correct. However I just tried it with the car in gear and it seems to reach full throttle with only 3/4 pedal movement which is wrong.
The fall off delay in RBR seems to be far too long, and like UrQuattro I have the filter set to instant for both fall off and rise. In a real car, after hitting maximum revs then taking your foot off the throttle altogether, the car would loose engine speed relatively slowly, but not at all as slow as in RBR.
Some things definately need tweaking here... |
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UrQuattro
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 2745
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 19:16 |
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Yes, and I have found out the reason. This is the common.lsp and inertia on gearbox and engine. Setting it to quicker times makes a world of difference. I get it fall off very fast. But is it realistic? What is realistic for WRC car! Not for normal car. Subaru and Skoda I think are using the fly by wire technology as well so how does that affect driving? I mean i just run a stage without trying by 2s quicker. So... Hmm.
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IvanThaDriver
Joined: 01 Apr 2004
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UrQuattro
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 2745
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 20:35 |
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Post a replay or video of you driving from inside, i want to see how you react on throttle, etc. I'm doing a video now of xsara in ss1 in france. Now the car is more GTR type feel, which is better on tarmac. I want to have a more linear response from thorttle vs engine, but i am satisfied with the fall off I have right now. It's similar to GTR which is pretty accurate. Ok, GTR and WRC are different things, but driving in GTR didn't cause me heaaches with throttle fall of rate. It does here.
Ivan, I don't have a steering lag, I've said this many times. Neither do I have a problem of throttle going only 90% or so. I've seen those threads, that's what they deal with it seems. People have problem with pedals when the pedals move side to side causing a bit of a screw up in the brains of the electornics, and that's why yuo lose from 5 to 20% of full throttle apparently. Now, I don't have that, if you watched the clip, my actual throttle pedal goes all the way, and gets back all the way. It's how RBR reads it. I will repeat this: in other games it works fine. Now, there's only one way I'm wrong - that in real WRC car there's exactly the same feel. But somehow, watching Loeb engine break in the xsara, I have reservations about that. I will link up to my drive in the Xsara in SS1 in france a bit later (stock physics).
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IvanThaDriver
Joined: 01 Apr 2004
Posts: 1340
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 20:39 |
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| UrQuattro wrote: |
| Ivan, I don't have a steering lag, I've said this many times. Neither do I have a problem of throttle going only 90% or so. I've seen those threads, that's what they deal with it seems. |
You didn't understand. My pedals are fine - it's not about "physical" bug. It's what you have shown in your video : you press "physical" pedal 10% and RBR "virtual" throttle goes 100%. It's "pedal lag". Wheel lag is caused by the same problem - unnecessary filters designed for digital devices but used for analog devices ...
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UrQuattro
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 2745
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 20:49 |
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Interesting, so to fix it you have to remove those digital filters?
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IvanThaDriver
Joined: 01 Apr 2004
Posts: 1340
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 20:53 |
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| Yeah, you have to burn them to hell. But it's not possible by the "normal" way - there is no option like this in RBR. We need a hackish tweak. Such tweak would get 1000000000000 downloads first day. And we shall spread it all over the world. |
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UrQuattro
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 2745
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 21:19 |
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| IvanThaDriver wrote: |
| Yeah, you have to burn them to hell. But it's not possible by the "normal" way - there is no option like this in RBR. We need a hackish tweak. Such tweak would get 1000000000000 downloads first day. And we shall spread it all over the world. |
So what you are saying, is there is a thread that talks about it, but in the end of the day, noone has been able to fix it? What are YOU using? Did you fix it for yourself?
Here's the video in france, in standard xsara: https://bhms.racesimcentral.net/movie/536
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grumpa
Joined: 15 Sep 2004
Posts: 305
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| Posted: Tue Nov 08, 00:20 |
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| Jim B wrote: |
The pedal movement and in game throttle % are realistic if you ask me. This is because there is no transmission resistance in neutral, so the car will keep revving up. The same would happen if you were sat in a real car and gave about 1/4 throttle, the car would slowly rev right up as there is no resistance from the transmission.
If the car was in gear, then the pedal movement would be more proportional to the in game engine revs.
The problem I have in RBR is if I press the brakes about 1/4 or less, the wheels lock up, meaning the brakes must be at 100 %? Anybody got an ideas about this? |
I have found that in most setups for RBR the rear brake pressure is overdone causing the rears to lock up at the slightest provocation.
Try any car on tarmac with fronts at 10000 and rears at 4500. 55/45
Real cars usually do upto 70% braking with fronts. Lots of variables involved i.e. weight transfer,weight distribution etc. Try a brake balance around 60% front 40% rear. With the Punto I had to set front 9200/rear 3300 or 74/26 to stop rears from locking up - it is of course FWD - lotsa weight on the front.
I don't see the brakes as having anything to do with controllers.
Also - I watched UrQuattro's video of Xsara four times - I fail to see/hear any appreciable throttle lag. I have never experienced any throttle lag with the MOMO. But then - I'm just an old fart.
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UrQuattro
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 2745
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| Posted: Tue Nov 08, 01:15 |
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Grumpa = i've fixed the throttle lag when I drove the xsara. But in original vid, in SS4 where I reve up, you can definately see it.
BTW, I'm running a very balance setup on xsara, totally neutral handling, and nearly similar split on braking (50/50) - which works very well for making the car stable underbraking - something crucial for me in a setup.
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IvanThaDriver
Joined: 01 Apr 2004
Posts: 1340
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| Posted: Tue Nov 08, 11:00 |
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Uh, my small shy voice once again  If any programmer would be able to prevent digital filters from working, I would send him a bottle of vodka, no matter what your occupation is  |
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UrQuattro
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 2745
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| Posted: Tue Nov 08, 11:36 |
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| IvanThaDriver wrote: |
| Uh, my small shy voice once again If any programmer would be able to prevent digital filters from working, I would send him a bottle of vodka, no matter what your occupation is |
Ok, can you seriously post exactly where the problem is? You know the problem well it seems, and understand it. If you post what the problem is exactly, may be something CAN be done. Don't be vague.
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